Trusting Your Cosmic Design with author Madi Murphy
You're listening to Lucid Cafe. I'm your host, Wendy Halley. Hello. Here we are just doing a little podcasting, trying to maintain a sense of normalcy as the world slips deeper into chaos. Everything's fine.
Wendy:It's fine. Oh, my. Actually, it's my hope that the guests I have the privilege to speak with, at least a lot of them, offer some perspectives to help you navigate our changing world. Little story. Many years ago, I had a shamanic experience where I connected with the spirit of the earth.
Wendy:Man, what an amazing presence she has. The goal of that particular experience was to find out what she needed from us. Well, when I connected with her, she she laughed when I asked her that question and with her beautiful melodic voice, she said that she was gonna be just fine. But she said that the best thing that we can do for her is to heal ourselves because then her human children will interact with her, the natural world, and all its inhabitants, ourselves, and each other with more love. Imagine that if a majority of us turned our focus inward and worked towards healing our wounds, reconnecting with our personal power, making peace with our shortcomings, finding harmony, and I'd love to live in that world.
Wendy:It's my hope that each of these episodes offer an opportunity or or an invitation. Some you may connect with and others not so much to do just that. So who knows? Today's guest may be someone whose message and approach is exactly what you needed. Madi Murphy is the author of In The Cosmic Zone.
Wendy:She offers readers a fresh perspective on personal empowerment that blends ancient astrological wisdom with practical modern application. She reveals the steps on how to access the cosmic zone, which is basically our highest potential and something we all have access to, and manifest our unique mission with clarity and courage. And she does this by offering a fresh and fun guide to working with the zodiac. Maddie is a cosmic leadership coach, a high vibe hype woman, and that is definitely true. You'll soon find that out.
Wendy:And the cofounder of CosmicRx. She coaches influential cultural leaders who wanna be seen for who they really are, not who the world wants them to be. So please enjoy my lively conversation with Madi Murphy.
Madi:Madi,
Wendy:thank you so much for joining me.
Madi:Thank you so much, Wendy. This is a treat.
Wendy:Wow. A treat. And we haven't really started yet.
Madi:I love all the green you have going. Green is like always like a mercury color for me. So I'm just ready to, like
Wendy:Yeah.
Madi:Yap yap with you.
Wendy:Okay. So we'll we'll green it up. Because Mercury is the communication planet. Correct?
Madi:Mhmm. Mhmm. Alright.
Wendy:Alright. I did it on purpose. No. Nope.
Madi:Alignment, baby. That's that's just living in alignment. I love when it's, like, unintentionally intentional. That's just you living in alignment. Right?
Wendy:Right. Who knew until right now? I didn't. I didn't. I didn't.
Wendy:No. I I should say that again. Alright. So speaking of astrology, you have a new book out. It is called In the Cosmic Zone, Embody the 12 Astro Archetypes to Unleash Your Genius and Activate Your Authentic Self.
Wendy:Okay. So this is quite an in a unique interpretation of astrology. And I was really taken aback by how, like, how probing and how helpful the questions are, the prompts are for each of the signs. But we're gonna talk about that in a second. Yes.
Wendy:Like, all of the things in which you're suggesting that each of the archetypes of the astrological signs, how they can kind of help us become more us.
Madi:Mhmm. Yeah. Alright. I'm a goat. That's well said.
Madi:I love that. So
Wendy:I'd love to hear a little bit about your journey, though. How did you get here to this place where you wrote this book? Because I suspect it wasn't I mean, you weren't raised with paying attention to your astrological chart.
Madi:No. I I I wish I was. I would have saved myself a lot of energy and time and just all the stuff that we leak away when we're in that place of self doubt. But the journey did lead me here, so I'm grateful for it. And there's sort of, like, many things in life, very complex little cocktail of being a human.
Madi:I was raised in a household that was way more fundamental Christian. We had bible study in the house. I was teaching it. So that was like definitely my mom was more to the traditional, like, Christian, the good girl energy, and, like, us being a great community member and, like, okay, hosting everyone and just studying that bible. My dad, he's a double Gemini Leo, and so he grew up Catholic altar boy.
Madi:Same thing. Like, wanted us to be raised in the church, but he was sort of my that that little, like, gateway drug that I needed because he really taught me with the double Gemini energy in that chapter of the book. Gemini energy to me is good at questioning things. Right? But why says who?
Madi:Like, let's turn things on its head. And so I would come back from church and be like, why are there no, like, women leaders? Because we're not Catholic. Like, this is just kinda like a made up, like, bible study. Like, why are there no women?
Madi:And he's like, well, I was like, let me tell you. And he started telling me about things where some days he'd like, we don't need to go to church. We could just sit outside in nature. That is church. And, you know, I would get invited to a bat mitzvah, and I'd be like, what's that?
Madi:And he'd be like, you gotta read the idiot's guide to the Torah because I can't just have you, like, go into these things and not understanding these different walks of life. And he really taught me to just question, question, question. Nothing's good or bad. You know, my church had some oopsie light Islamophobia around 09:11. And I'm rotating, dad, how do we know that we're right and they're wrong?
Madi:And he's like, we don't. He's like, we're all just doing the best we can. He's like, our job is just to try to not be assholes. And I'm like, okay. Okay.
Madi:And so that gave me, I think, a good like, I had that from going to church. I had why I liked it and why I liked worship songs and even the gathering is I had that innate sense in me that, like, we were connected to something bigger. Right? Like, there's some kind of larger force behind everything we're doing, some sort of consciousness, and I liked opportunities to connect with that. And to me, that was a lot through music, through connection with other people.
Madi:But the dogma and and everything that I was sort of questioning, my my dad gave me a good out. And then I had, like most people have, the cool aunt. My cool auntie, my aunt Gail, you know, she was a very elegant but chic, I would say, like, hippie. And she had moved out to California in, like, the seventies and studied with all these famous numerologists and astrologers. So she would read for me a little bit.
Madi:I didn't really totally understand it. And again, like, I kind of had that conflicting thing from my church of like, this is evil, but I also liked it. I was like, oh, oh, oh. So it was there. It was simmering.
Madi:And I always had, you know, I'm sure there's a lot of people listening to this relate to just those like an understandable, ineffable, but totally rock solid, like, gifts of other things. Right? Like unknowing, an intuitive knowing, a certain universal truths I just understood as a child, not knowing how kind of old soul things. And then, you know, going on the journey of being an adult, I I kinda cast away things from the church, but also cast away things from my spiritual practice as I started to conform to being a New Yorker, checking the boxes, you know, going into the career, the life, about to get married. And then right before I was about to get married, I just had my first real spiritual breakdown breakthrough about, like, oh my god.
Madi:I'm living such an inauthentic life. My body shut down. I couldn't eat. I couldn't sleep. I felt like a prisoner in my own life.
Madi:Like, I just felt so out of my power, and it was I couldn't ignore it anymore. It was like I had kind of slowly turned the volume down on my intuition and all that inner knowing and all that authentic expression to, like, fit in. And all of a sudden overnight, it was like I just couldn't function or get out of bed, but I also couldn't sleep. So I called off my wedding about two weeks before I was gonna get married and just was like, well, I am broke. I don't have any future plans.
Madi:I don't have a job because I had to quit my job to move to be closer to my fiance. My parents got a divorce, sold a child at home, all in like a two week span. Then I was like, okay. So I gotta figure out who I am. And I was like, you know what?
Madi:I'm kind of like, quote unquote, desperate enough to be like, I'm just gonna return back to that stuff that I like to do as a child. And I started just, you know, kind of devouring spiritual books from the library, you know, going to as many free or donation based yoga classes as I could, sitting just with a journal and a a pen in a Washington Square park because also all those things were, like, free. And I was getting really broke. So, you know, long story long, I discovered that that was two weeks before my Saturn return. And when someone read that for me in my chart and I got my first chart reading as an adult, that just validated everything that I had had been experiencing.
Madi:It gave me a sense of, oh, I don't have to downplay these parts of myself or diminish them. These are actually this is who I am. This is my needs. These are my gifts. And it gave me such a map to start rebuilding my life on purpose with purpose.
Madi:And then I kinda just never looked back. And it was just something that I was like, I need to teach learn more about this, and I wanna teach everyone about it. But, you know, as we know it, when we start talking about astrology, people's eyes start going cross eyed or, like, horoscopes in the newspaper. Right. So then I was like, okay.
Madi:Now I gotta teach people about this. But again, I'm a New Yorker. I'm a Virgo. I'm like, how do I make it accessible and practical? So that's Alright.
Madi:That's been the journey.
Wendy:Yeah. It sounds like quite the dismemberment experience, which is
Madi:Exactly. Yeah. Not pleasant, but, you know, very very shamanic, very like
Wendy:Very necessary.
Madi:Dark night of the soul, very death, very yeah. Very just throwing everything in. But, of course, as I'm sure people listening who might have experienced something on paper, everything awful, nothing there, burned the whole life down. Right? But then in my soul, I remember waking up that morning after calling up my wedding and being like, oh my god, I feel so free.
Madi:And I was like, okay. Like, this feels good. I wanna keep following and chasing kinda like this feeling. Yeah.
Wendy:Yeah. No. That's that's it just reminds me of in fact, reading your book was reminding me of how much we can get caught up in the ideas of what we're supposed to do and how we're supposed to be. Yeah. And, like, I'd have to say the common thread I took from your book was, like, permission to be yourself.
Wendy:Like, no matter what the yeah. Because you refer to them as keys. Mhmm. The astro archetypes. Like, no matter what key you're working on, they're all like, the common denominator seems to be permission to be yourself.
Wendy:Yeah. But from different angles.
Madi:Yeah. No. That's beautifully observed and and beautifully said, and that's what I think. I think, like, Mike, so many of us are waiting for some external force to validate us or approve of something within us, so much energy and so much of our life force on hiding ourselves or folding ourselves in, making ourselves small. And it just feels like this is the time in history for all of us just to really, like, the road and the map that was laid out or the story that was sold to us.
Madi:I think we're all realizing, like, oh, that's not really working anymore. So why don't we go within, figure out who we are, have permission to be that? And I just think people who are in their full expression are way less likely to want to limit, judge, or oppress other people for living in their full expression. So it also creates a beautiful ripple effect out in the world.
Wendy:Well said. I'm actually wondering if the kind of guidelines for life, especially in American culture, have served anybody. Maybe a small percentage of people.
Madi:Right. But
Wendy:for the most part, we're all kind of playing this game or on this hamster wheel, doing the things we're supposed to be doing says who and
Madi:Exactly. Like, says who And we
Wendy:then what how what's the percentage of people on antidepressants and anti anxiety medications? It's very high. I don't know what it is as of right now, but I know it's super high. Yeah. Really high.
Wendy:All all indicators that we're
Madi:not in any The medication, the numbing, whether it's through actual, like, pharmaceutical meds or just, like, addiction to the phone or shopping or all these different things that we just, like, looking for some sort of aliveness and life force because we've, like, kind of folded ourselves in and then shut down all of these, like, beautiful channels that we have to be more connected to the universe and each other. And, yeah, that's I think that is, like, one of the true, you know, pandemic of our times or something is that.
Wendy:It's Yeah. All bullshit.
Madi:Yes. They're dipping into my little astro anarchist energy.
Wendy:I guess I have that in high quantities. Alright. So what led to you just kind of seeing astrology through this lens that ended up being your book?
Madi:You know, I think my love affair with astrology is long, and there's so beautiful stories I have where it just lended me something that I really needed in a moment in time, some kind of magic or medicine. I think about these certain clarifying moments, one of them was really obviously, again, I am not like a math and science girly. I'm like the English, the storytelling, the art girl in school. So my first barrier of entry into wanting to go deeper with astrology, I was like, but the numbers and the degrees and the aspects and the angles. I'm like, what?
Madi:I did study with a very traditional teacher who made me learn all of that. And then he said, you learn all of this, like anything you do music, so then you can improv and you can do it more intuitively, but learn the fundamentals. I was like, sure. And he kept telling me, he's like, oh my god. The way your brain works because I I just kept going back to this more like kind of like a shamanic approach.
Madi:I was like, oh, hey. But these are like the planet is like our spirit guide. And he's like, not really a spiritual astrologer at all. So he's like, I see what you're saying. He's like, you know what?
Madi:You should read this book, Shamanic Astrology by Daniel Daniel Giamaro. And I was like, okay. I go online. It's like not anywhere. It's like, I get like one used copy from Abe Books.
Madi:And oh my god, Wendy, reading this book, I was like, did I write this book in a past life? Because it was everything that I had been thinking and how I was viewing the archetypal energy of the planets and the zodiac signs less as, you know, I don't I I can read more like traditionally and and future casting and looking at things. But I'm like, oh, I like astrology as this, like, interpretation of this, like, planetary poetry in motion of, like, the celestial story of your soul. Like, why are you here? Who are the players?
Madi:What's happening? What's the karma? What are we, you know, expanding into? What are we releasing? Why are we here?
Madi:Right? Like, of course, it's interesting to look at the, you know, more fine tuned things. But I'm always like, why are we here? Like, what what are we doing? And how do we live in our fullest expression?
Madi:And so going through these shamanic archetypes, like, I had literally named my business at the time cosmic revolution because we were doing, like, moon circles. And I'm like, oh, I love this idea that there's a revolution coming. I was seeing it in the astrology, but what if we do it cosmically? And I just love this concept. And everyone's like, what does that mean?
Madi:Where did you come up with that? I'm like, I don't know. I just like it. And in this book, when I got it, the archetype energy for Aquarius, which we're entering, you know, right now, we're in Pluto and Aquarius, and this is kind of what I was seeing coming down the pipeline. The archetype that Daniel wrote about was the cosmic revolutionary.
Madi:And I was like, oh my god. Like, it was so cool. So his study
Wendy:for what you're describing.
Madi:It felt like coming home into learning this language. And then as I started working with clients and mentees and my own family and myself about like, okay, first and foremost, you know, I always like to remind everyone, they carry all 12 signs within them. You know, no one is lacking a sign. No one has more zodiac signs in their chart than you do. If you are judging a sign, guess what?
Madi:You have it in your chart. If you are jealous of a sign and you wish you had that, guess what? You have it in your chart. It's like a shamanic wheel. Like, it's a wheel that we are just like a medicine wheel.
Madi:We're going over and around every year. And every year, it really teaches us something about ourselves in this kind of, like, spiral golden spiral energy of life. So when I started working with myself, clients, and other people, I mean, like, okay. Here's a section of your chart, and let's work on that in the solar season or as you have bigger transits coming through and really looking to be like, what's that archetypal energy that you either are very aware of? Because maybe you do have a lot of planets there.
Madi:So psychologically, emotionally, you're primed, you're ready to go on that. Or maybe you don't have any planets in that part of your chart. So you actually maybe are a little bit asleep to that, but it is there. It's dormant. It wants to be woken up.
Madi:But it's not, I like to say, astrology that's defining you, the kind that I'm into. Like, it's interesting to read like, you are a Venus in Gemini. You like to do this. You like to do that. That's interesting.
Madi:That's I've been into that in the past. But when it comes to this really transformative energy of working with astrology, I like to think about astrology that's aligning you. Oh, yeah. Like the questions, the embodiment, the what does this mean to you? How does this give you permission in this part of your chart to really apply this and to stretch into it and to expand?
Madi:And so, yeah, this sort of concept of the key is was just birth because I realized that, oh, every kind of universal block that we feel as humans when we're just getting ready to do something that is courageous and from the heart and asking our soul to grow and expand, we come up against these universal blocks, these fears, these self doubts, these like, oh, I wanna crawl back into my comfort zone moments. I noticed that each of the 12 zodiac signs and the archetypal energy them held the truth that could really unlock those blocks. Some of them, again, are gonna be based on your chart more relevant during certain parts of your life or not. We're always changing. We're dynamic.
Madi:But there's something in this book that I believe that people could come back to over and over again or just open up to a random page like an oracle and be like, oh, okay. Maybe that was something that was just waiting for my soul to be like, hey, brain. Remember that you actually have this huge untapped resource in in your in your chart, in your heart, and here are some prompts, and here's some storytelling, here's some encouragement and practices to help you remember that, right, and come back into your wholeness. Because, again, we carry all 12 signs. We're all whole.
Madi:No one was born, like, missing a piece.
Wendy:Yes. Wow. Okay. So that led you to share in a very succinct way through this book. And so the book is is split into well, it's got, of course, the introduction, kind of introducing the reader to what they're about to do.
Wendy:And then most of the book is split into each key for the 12 signs. It's 12. Right?
Madi:Mhmm. Yeah.
Wendy:That's right. It's in the yeah. Okay. Obviously, I'm not schooled in astrology really well. But and then it's kind of like through storytelling and how you can look at that particular sign, like you're saying, through the archetype, the archetypal lens, and push yourself if you take yourself up on it to push you push yourself through the challenge you may be experiencing with that particular house or not house, but through that particular sign.
Wendy:Mhmm. I don't know if I used the astrology language correctly.
Madi:You are. You're actually you're doing a great job. You're doing a great job.
Wendy:Alright. So I was wondering that was gonna be one of my questions is how do you ideally want people to use this book? Do you want them to go I mean, some people are probably, maybe depending on their sign, wanna start at the beginning and go through to the end. And then other people are like, screw that. I'm gonna do it Yeah.
Wendy:The way I wanna do it. So what was your intention?
Madi:My intention is very much choose your own adventure, and I really think about three ways to work with a book like this. I think the first way could just be like that if just read it, you know, cover to cover or even just picking up a random page. I always like a kind of little bibliomancy. Like, what do I need to know today? Open it up.
Madi:And that could be for people who have no astrological background or or even, like, don't even wanna learn. Some people are just like, I'm good. I'm done. My brain is saturated. I don't need to go into learning about astrology.
Madi:You could read this book just like a guide, just like a self development book to help you just, you know, think, muse, hopefully give you a little encouragement, a little permission in general as a human. And then way number two, which I think is good for people who are cosmically curious and and, you know, or just, again, looking to embody more what they've been learning about astrology from the more analytical point of view, which is every chapter of the book correlates to zodiac sign and therefore a zodiac season. So this could be like a cosmic calendar where you focus on one chapter a month and the dates are in the book to really see that cosmic revolution that I was talking about before. I talk about it in the book. It's the revolution we're living in.
Madi:But actually, in astrology, your journey for the year is called a solar revolution because, you know, you're you're having the sun go through every single part of your chart, lighting it up, and it's almost like a new version of solar power. And what I loved about it is as someone who, yes, is always interesting in growing and learning more about myself, I became so overwhelmed and so, like, turned off by the self help, self care industry, industrial self care complex that was, like, booming a few years ago and is still going strong now where I was like, I don't know. Am I am I am organizing my drawers color coded, or am I doing my masks? Am I doing a digestive cleanse? Am I like, am I red lighting?
Madi:Am I biohacking? Am I?
Wendy:That was the thing I was gonna say before when we were talking about addictions, kind of, like, addictions And to even you can get addicted to kind of, like, spirituality and the wellness world.
Madi:Totally.
Wendy:Yeah. Is it like Totally. Sort of
Madi:Never ending. Looking
Wendy:for that looking for that thing.
Madi:Like, he put a thing like that next spiritual high or that navel gazing of like, what's the next problem I have to fix? And sometimes I'm like, girl, like, you're good. Like, you're good. Like, you've done a lot of healing. Now you just gotta enjoy life.
Madi:Or, like, you know what? Get outside yourself. Be of service. Like, it's not all about, like, oh, what's the next thing I have to fix within myself? And I do love the zodiac season, you know, gives you some prompts right now.
Madi:It's Leo season. Can I do tropical western astrology? Are you a Leo?
Wendy:I'm a Leo.
Madi:Oh my god.
Madi:I know. I was gonna should I was like, she's giving me Leo. She's giving me Aquarius. But like, it's all that fixed energy. It's that that full radical self expression is so important.
Madi:And so Leo season for all of us gives us permission to almost do like cosmic costuming and put on some Leo energy even if we don't naturally carry that or resonate with it and all be a little bit, you know, in our most, like, courageous, confident, a little bit, like, audacious selves in the name of living in alignment with our heart's truth. Right? Share your heart. Share your art. It's Leo season.
Madi:Like, take up space. Shine brightly. Also, have fun. In the Northern Hemisphere, we're all like, yeah. This is the time of year to, like, be in our light.
Madi:Right? Like, it's summertime. Fruits of our labor, it's like enjoy them, be outside, eat good food, chase fireflies, skinny dip in the ocean. I'm like, it's such a Leo season energy. And then that carries us.
Madi:If you and in my book, I talk about practices you could do, prompts, things to think about. What I noticed that happened, it wasn't just like, oh, that it activates in that Leo season. It's like a solar panel in your chart that now it's like charged up for the next year. And then that builds on to the next sign. So then next season, you know, we'll have Virgo season where we'll be editing or decluttering or getting back into our rituals.
Madi:And that might teach us something or inform something about us that, again, is helping us set up for the full next year. And then before you know it, after a year, you've gone through this really beautiful transformation from the inside out that feels sustainable, that feels grounded, and that feels, like, long lasting and intentional, right, versus trying to do all this stuff overnight. Right. Right. Where does it get us?
Wendy:Are you saying that there's a kind of a natural progression if you follow it month to month?
Madi:Absolutely. And and, you know, back to the why I love the zodiac archetypes and everything in the zodiac season, the whole wheel of the zodiac is an evolutionary story of our human journey. And again, we go through it macro in our lifetime, like, woah. But also we go through it again every year as we, you know, walk the medicine wheel, I believe. But it's like in the in the cosmos.
Madi:If we start with Aries, the first sign of the zodiac. And Aries is I am. And this is why I always tell people, get rid of those New Year's resolutions. Don't try and change your life in January. Are you crazy?
Madi:Like, that is so dusty patriarchal, like, capitalism, extract of capitalism. Like, oh, you think we're gonna change our lives in the dead of winter? Like, come on. No. The spring equinox coincides with the first day of Aries season, and it's that like, oh, it's that rebirth.
Madi:Right? It's that like, Aries season is like, let's do something fresh. Who am I? What am I care about? What lights my fire?
Madi:It's cardinal energy, which means it's initiating some kind of fire. And Aries is sort of like the firstborn of the zodiac, all about the self, all about who I am. And then that goes into Taurus season. Then it's like, okay. I am.
Madi:But now Taurus is like, I have. And Taurus is very much connected to the three d realm, the five senses. So like, oh, right. My body, nature. What do I need around me?
Madi:Food. What do I need to feel safe? And how do I sort of ground into all of that and ground and get back into my body, get back into and I feel like, again, in Northern Hemisphere, tourist season is always bringing in that springtime energy. And we're kinda like, oh, right. Like, let's, you know, get in the garden or we're, like, you know, enjoying, you know, nature walks or just feeling more into those the pleasure of being a human, hopefully.
Madi:And then that leads into Gemini, which is, you know, I connect. I communicate. Gemini season has this, you know, being social, wanting to think about things differently. And so each sign builds off of the last sign, especially sort of where the last sign can start to get a little bit, you know, where it needs a little help. So it's like, okay, just as tourist season is tipping the scales into being maybe a little bit like only focused on what's in front of them and that's where tourists can get a little bit like stubborn stereotype.
Madi:It's like, okay, then Gemini comes in to be like, let's shake it up. Let's question everything. You know? But why? Who says?
Madi:Let's bring in that. And then just as Gemini seasons, woo, often, like, we're questioning too much and we're, like, too in the airspace and our social calendar is a little too booked, we go into cancer season, which has us going into the home, right, into the hearth, into the who's our family? How do we feel at home in the world? What do we need? And so on and so forth.
Madi:And you know, I could obviously go through all of them. But if for time's sake, I don't have to. But there is a really beautiful wheel and that's why again I love that assignment of working with each chapter in one month of the year because you will start to understand also like oh that is what that zodiac sign means. Beyond the meme, beyond a horoscope. It's like, oh, that's what Libra energy means about collaborating and being open and living in more harmony with myself and the world.
Madi:Does that make sense to you?
Wendy:Yeah. No. It does. It's really helpful. I was wondering, you've been working with clients for some time because you reference client stories in your book.
Wendy:And I was wondering if you've noticed any trends in your work with clients around I don't know. I don't know what makes me wanna ask that question, but maybe it's the pattern recognition part of my brain.
Madi:I I love those patterns. I can't stop seeing them. I think that's why I love astrology so much because it's just basically the recognition of patterns and then giving a little cosmic context to it.
Wendy:Yeah. So I was just wondering if you've noticed any change in your work with clients that that contributed to the book.
Madi:Absolutely. And, you know, that will segue into the third and final way to work with the book. The pattern that I noticed is yeah. There's so many. But one of them and the overarching one is maybe more of a belief than a pattern, but I have seen enough proof in the pudding to call it that.
Madi:Okay. Is that I think there's something interesting about astrology especially. It's almost like just the turning to face the cosmos, so to speak, but really just the cosmic multiverse within you. Just turning to face them. Just having some kind of curiosity.
Madi:Just wanting to learn more about this. It's like the cosmos turned to face you in that remembering like, oh, right. Hey, my dear child. You know, the universe, god, source, spirit, your ancestors, your angels, whatever you wanna identify that as, that higher power is like, great. We're so happy that you remembered that you're not doing this alone and that you actually have this blueprint and this whole system and this language to help you feel more you in the world.
Madi:And so to me, like, going into astrology with a certain open hearted, open mindedness, it isn't just about, again, learning and memorizing. Oh, I have Saturn in this part of my chart. It's like, oh, remembering that I have, again, this whole multiverse within me, and I have a map to understanding how to bring it out in the world. And, also, I'm opening myself up to all my clients. I have opened up to other realms of intuitive guidance, knowing.
Madi:Because again, you're you're turning back to something that's bigger than yourself. And then the other thing I will say in a more practical level of a pattern recognition is that everyone, I don't care, people work with me day one on their spiritual journeys and being like, don't know what's going on. I'm having all these thoughts and I need help. Or I just appeared like ask for very like blunt career advice and not caring for the spiritual side. Or I've worked with people in their side in returns.
Madi:Or I've worked with people who are deep you know, way ever, like, further on their spiritual path than I. Worked with people who are Fortune 50 CEOs or people in Hollywood. People who are all different levels. Okay. Every single one of those people has had a moment where they need to do something that scares the ever loving shit out of them.
Madi:Because all those people, the common denominator is that they were in some way heart centered, meaning they wanted to live more from the heart and they couldn't fake things and they couldn't just do things because people told them to. And they had some kind of bigger sense of purpose, some sort of other kind of potential, some sort of other level of life that their soul wanted to expand into and experience. And whether that was clearing generational wounds, starting a business, falling in love, moving on other side of the world, starting nonprofit, whatever it is. And every single one of them has had the moment of, like, who am I to do this? And, like, I can't do this.
Madi:And and I'm not made for this. I'm not built for this. And all of those things that creep in the head. And that's why the start of the book, the first key is the Aries key that every single one of us need that pep talk once in a while of remembering, yeah, why not you? Like, why not you?
Madi:If someone's gotta do it, like, why do we think that everyone else has permission to go after something or do something? And again, I say this of like the wide, the vast spectrum of people I've worked with. And once they can overcome that, and it's not even about having it all figured out, it's never about having the plan all figured out because the plan will change many times over. It's just that self honoring, that self trust, that self permission, like you said, of just, okay. I can just take one step.
Madi:One step that's showing myself, the universe, all of creation that I am ready to step into this role and then like the rest follows is the thing that makes all the difference. It's 99% of the work. It's just saying, why not me? Let's effing go. Right?
Madi:So those are the two things that I would say that have been universal truths across every single person I've worked with.
Wendy:Alright. Cool. That's very cool. Yeah. As you were saying all that, I was thinking about reflecting on the trend in my shamanic healing sessions lately.
Wendy:I've been a practitioner for, I don't know, like twenty five years or so. And a lot of work has been done on their foundations of trust. Like, that's one like, the first place that my helping spirits end up going is to their foundation of trust. And most of us have really fucked foundations of trust. Shocking.
Wendy:I know. Yeah. But the spirit that's been coming forward to serve as new foundations, the the person's new foundation of trust, because usually their old
Madi:wound is
Wendy:so wounded, they have to it has to be extracted. So they start from scratch, is the spirit of the night sky.
Madi:Mhmm.
Wendy:That comes to service Oh. Of Isn't that cool?
Madi:Well, well, well. That's so cool. I love that. And
Wendy:the idea of trusting in your inner guidance and looking up to the stars and knowing that all of the answers are right up there. That's what the night sky is reflecting to the person every time it shows up for them.
Madi:That's so beautiful. Wow. I love that weaving. I love, like, when we get the same sort of information or downloads across many different people, many different wisdom paths.
Wendy:Cool. Right?
Madi:It's just truth. It's like truth. You're like, that's truth. Oh, that's so good. Yeah.
Madi:Okay. And then so
Wendy:just popped into my head as you were talking. I'm like, oh, yeah. Nice.
Madi:Yeah. Because when you and I look at you like, I don't know why I was asking about patterns. And I'm like, I don't either. And I'm just gonna say, there's so many things I could say, but that is one that, you know, is really true. And and so that's interesting.
Madi:I'm gonna really carry that with me because I do feel like that is sort of like one of the reasons I I wrote this book and what I feel like is kind of our collective medicine right now is rebuilding that that whether it's the macro, the micro, and the inner world, the outer world, like we have to rebuild a lot of foundations of trust in order to, like, what I like to call maybe part of the joyful reimagining of where we're going from here versus just being like, everything's weird.
Wendy:Yeah. And that seems fucked.
Madi:Yeah. I was say, I hope your girls are gonna say, I fucked.
Wendy:Big time. You can say it. Yeah. So and that's that's Pisces medicine. Right?
Madi:Mhmm. Yeah. So that's the final, you know, the twelfth key because I just wanted to offer you know, even in this book, the whole thing is a a transmission. Like, I I had a little bit of a, you know, segue here, but I had someone had approached me to write a book years ago, and it was it was a dream of mine. So I was so flattered and honored.
Madi:They wanted me to write about something that the industry wanted that was hot. And Ashley's like, okay. Cool. Cool. Cool.
Madi:Virgo, like, people pleasing mode and just trying to crank out this proposal. And it was so bad. It was so bad. It was so forced. And the whole process just I didn't like it.
Madi:And I just had to, you know, finally kinda like take the ego hat off, come back into the hard space, and just say like, I politely decline. This is just not like for me. I don't want to write a book. I want to write a book that is imbued with the energy that I want people to receive from it. I want to feel inspired in my flow state.
Madi:Yes. There'll be challenges. I had to walk myself through all of these keys in the process of writing and promoting this book, but I have chills. Like, this book is just infused with magic. I put so many spells.
Madi:I wove so I connecting to so many of our collective ancestors and the earth and so much that's so beyond me. And that's why the twelfth key, no matter what I do in my work, it always comes back to the twelfth key. I'm a Pisces moon. I always believe that I'm a human. I am so not intelligent in terms of, like, I don't know all the answers.
Madi:I didn't even know how I got here to writing a book. But what I do know is that I have some wisdom from my lived experience. I have some things that I I think work that I've seen people's lives. But why I know this book is going to help and change some people's lives is because, like, I trust. I trust.
Madi:And I put in here the energy of, like, let this just connect to something in someone's heart that needed to hear. Let this be a cosmic stepping stone to them connecting to their spirit guides, to the universe. Let this just be the next golden illuminated thread of yes that someone needs to pull on to go deeper into themselves. And all the work I do, I always bring in people's guide. You know, whether it's like a business course I'm teaching or a one on one session.
Madi:Because I always say, I'm like, I'm a channel here, but I'm a flawed human. Like, I don't know what's going on. I'm just on the next to everyone like, are you seeing this? This is yeah. It's kinda fucked up out here.
Madi:But once you go into that place of I trust, it can like unclench. Right? And just be like
Wendy:It's the toughest one, though. I think it's the toughest one. And I think that you that's what you're talking about is it's like it's like I think it's a common trajectory is when you wanna follow your heart, you have a dream, and there's usually an obstacle that comes your way. And yours came in the form of a publishing industry thing. And I Yes.
Wendy:I I certainly have had my share of experiences in that realm, where your ego will get an opportunity to maybe pursue your dream, but you have to sell yourself short. And then you have you're at a crossroads where you either sell or you were like, I'm gonna do it the way I originally intended, and that feels right to me rather than what I think is what people want.
Madi:Exactly. Because you always just feel again, like you talked about the sort of a fragmenting. It's like all those moments when we just betray ourselves or and it it sounds like a dramatic word, but it is true when we're just being like someone else wants this of me or I think this is like what sounds good on paper without going into that place of like, is this really my truth? And can I trust myself that like, my truth will find me? You know, even if I have to say no a thousand that's like, you know, calling off the wedding, say no to the original publishing deals.
Madi:These are moments. And I'm not gonna say I was there in, like, a white flowing dress just like doves around me, like, I trust. No. I'm like sweating and me calling my sister and being like, am I sure? Am I fucking my whole career up right now?
Madi:Am I fucking my whole life up right now? And then just being like that other feeling that like home of, you know, your intuitive compass wanting to take you back onto your path. I'm like, I'm just gonna like feel like this is so loud in me right now and it's taking over my whole body that I just have to trust it because it feels too uncomfortable to Yeah. No. It's like a choice.
Madi:I don't have a choice. And so there were so many times where I was getting harassed by my spirit guides. Like sign after sign after sign. I was like, okay, fine. I will honor my truth.
Madi:Okay. I get it.
Wendy:Oh, they're so obnoxious. Sometimes?
Madi:So Sometimes. They're so not subtle.
Wendy:Alright. So I got a little derailed. Yeah. What is the third way which we
Madi:can get
Wendy:into the book?
Madi:Yeah. So, of course, these are for people who under or wanna understand a little bit more about their actual chart and what it means. So the first thing you can do is obviously just look up your sun sign and I would love people are gonna do. So going in and rooting for your sun sign. Your sun sign is going to be like your personal power key because even though astrology is so much more than your sun sign, your sun sign is so important.
Madi:It is literally how you are meant to carry, like, your life force, your light, shine your light, and nourish as many people and projects and things on earth with as little amount of stress and strain for you as needed like the sun. Right? And how you're meant to be in your authentic effing brilliance is very much through your sun sign. So go in there. But then you can go in and really go through different parts of your chart.
Madi:I have a little appendix. It's on, like, page two zero two, two zero three, two zero four. I didn't wanna scare people away with like it's just was not my kind of medicine of going into the nitty gritty of a chart. But I did put a little thing back there if you just want a little like, okay. So my Venus sign, what is needed for me to feel loved and appreciated, my values, my relationship to money, my preferred aesthetics.
Madi:This key is gonna help me understand what I value the most and how I express my love language and heart's truths. You can look up your Venus sign on astro.com. We're actually coming up with a little chart, you know, calculator for our website. Just pop in your birth info and be like, okay. My Venus is in Sagittarius.
Madi:So it's like, great. Go to the ninth key and think about all of that through the lens of, like I just said, your relationships, your love, your values. Oh, right. This whole chapter is about travel and experience and broadening your horizons and feeling free, you know. And it's like, okay, that's something that I really need in that area of my life.
Madi:And now that I know that and it's kind of a non negotiable, what does that open up within me? Right? How does that align me? And so likewise, you can do that for every part of your chart. Similarly, every chart has an every part of your chart has an opposite sign because we can go too much.
Madi:We can be too much of a sign. There's no this thing's a bad sign, but there is unconscious expression of it. Right? And every sign has a high and a low octave.
Wendy:Much Leo. Come on.
Madi:You're like every sign but Leo. I'm just teasing. The most Leo if astrology isn't real thing. Right? But then so Leo, the balance is Aquarius.
Wendy:Very Leo thing.
Madi:I love the very Leo thing. It's so perfect and it's so on brand. And I'm just like, my Virgo's like, I appreciate that. I appreciate that attention to detail. So, yeah, you can go in and and read for, like, the Aquarius op and it says right in the opposite Balance
Wendy:yourself out, kind of. Yeah.
Madi:Yeah. It just helps us figure out, like, oh, right. Again, there's nothing bad about any sign ever. But we can be in a place where we're like, oh, we're just putting a little too much gas there. We need to kinda pull back and and give it a little juice, a little break, a little downshifting or whatever.
Madi:And when we do that, we can actually see the GIFs of the original sign so much more clearly.
Wendy:Okay. Great. So you mentioned your website, and you have, like, a whole community. Yeah?
Madi:Yeah. We have a whole cool community, like, couple thousand people all across the world, the like minded lunarverse of just cosmic baddies and modern mystics and witchy weirdos who just wanna have a place to like hang and talk about this and hold space for each other and work with the moon. I said, work with the moon, not for the man. And just like dream weave together. And it's it's pretty cool.
Madi:That's all available, you know, information on the website.
Wendy:Which is?
Madi:Cosmicrx.com, I think. Let me double check. Yeah. I wanna it's cosmicr okay. It's cosmicrx.com.
Madi:Yeah. And you could see that on there. We also have a ton of we're really interested in a few years ago, I got really, again, turned off by, like, some things in the wellness sphere, you know, a lot of I understand people to make money, and that's not it. But just the over commodification of of certain things, especially things are just ancient principles and truths. So we are on a mission to, you know, democratize magic, if you will.
Madi:And and so we have a lot of things that are for free. We have a blog. We have a free birth chart decoder. I do a weekly podcast. We're always just doing, like, also scholarships for our program.
Madi:So come to the website and just poke around. There's probably something there for you wherever you're at on your journey.
Wendy:Great. And do you still work with people individually?
Madi:I took a little pause because of the book. And then I, by accident, had two babies in a year, and that made me very busy while writing a book.
Wendy:Accidentally had two babies in one year, but not at the same time, I'm guessing.
Madi:Not at the same time. Alright. No. It was a you know, when it rains, it pours. Amazing blessing.
Madi:I accidentally Pours babies. Yeah. Pours babies. And I think I vision boarded too hard because I wanted to call in a baby for a long time, and I was very blessed too. But then I realized that I put in a picture of a toddler leaning over a newborn baby.
Madi:And I think something in my subconscious was just like, let's do that. And I I ended up having Irish twins. So, yeah, two boys, 12 apart. So I took a little pause on the one on one work, but I will be starting that up again in 2026 in January. So
Wendy:Okay. Which is might be around when this comes out anyway.
Madi:Oh, fantastic. Yeah. Perfect. And it's gonna be another wild year, so come on in.
Wendy:That's what I'm hearing. Yeah. That's what that's what I'm hearing. So wherever you need support,
Madi:get it.
Wendy:Alright. So there was one other little rabbit hole I wanted to go down real quick before I let you go back to your
Madi:Let's do it.
Wendy:Your two little little guys. I noticed you referenced studying shamanism. And so I was just curious about what pulled you in that direction and how did you like, what tradition did you end up studying and
Madi:Okay. I'm so happy you brought this up because this is just one of those moments of, like, again, as a child, I always suspected and felt that magic was real. And just the more I've turned to this path, the more I'm just like so so confirmed. And I think going to shaman school was such an anchoring and a validation of so many things that I just felt intuitively. But the journey to getting there, I maybe like some people may find you.
Madi:I think I knew about shamanism. I was intrigued by it, but I also had no idea what it meant or what it was. And I Right? Didn't You were kinda like and it's like, what? But oh, but tell me more.
Madi:But what? And for one of my birthdays, I went to one of those float tank type of things and I just wanted to, like, tune in. I was feeling kind of unclear a lot in my life. And I nothing really came out of it until the very end. Like, I was about to get out and I went into this deep, like, an instant sleep, but it was very vivid.
Madi:And I saw my paternal grandfather who I never met, who was a Irish Canadian, you know, fisherman from Nova Scotia I'm sorry, New Finland. And I was just like, grandpa John? Like, he was in a rocking chair, and he just said the word shaman to me. And I was like, okay. But, like, you know, my grandpa John was not vibing with the shamanic energy that I knew of at least.
Madi:So I was like, what does this mean? Fast forward, I had a coffee shop in Brooklyn, and we sold, you know, some drinks that I was trying to do, like plant based fun, whimsical, but healing beverages. And a woman came in and she's like, what is this play? Who owns this place? And she's like, I saw a unicorn latte, a mermaid, a purple amethyst latte.
Madi:What's happening here? And she's like, I run a shaman school, and you need to go. And I was like, okay. Shaman, shaman. But still being in my own way, in my own head, I just said, nope.
Madi:I don't have the time. I don't have the money. I'm running two businesses. I'm broke. I have no op I can't do this.
Madi:And she just kept coming into my shop every once in a while when she was in town. She's from California. And then, you know, through a chance, long journey I went through that I talk about in the book, I Yeah. I came into a teeny bit of intense right? I came into a teeny bit of a little bit of money that was literally to the dollar, the exact amount that I needed for shaman school.
Wendy:Thanks Starbucks. Right.
Madi:So oh, yeah. Thanks Starbucks.
Wendy:So like a lawsuit that she's referencing.
Madi:Yeah. And and we settled, and it was a whole a whole that was a whole karmic journey. But I was like, okay. I'm paying attention. And then so I went, and it was called Pampa Masayak Shaman School, and it started by Steven Feely, who studied under Alberto Viotto from the 12 Okay.
Wendy:Yeah. The four wins or whatever.
Madi:Four wins. Yeah. 12 wins. Four wins. And I didn't really resonate with some of the lots of wins.
Madi:I didn't really resonate with the four wins when I had studied it and looked at it. Just, I don't know, just whatever. You don't resonate with something. But when she told me about the school, this woman, Colleen McCann, who was teaching at the time there, you know, she was like me, Virgo, New Yorker, LA, New Yorker stylist, you know, turned like shaman medium. I was like, okay.
Madi:She's intriguing to me. And then my first phone call with Steven, I was like, I have never been in a more, like, kind, sacred masculine, like, pure presence in my life. So Alright. Brother did his work. Okay.
Madi:Brother brother is doing the work he does. And that whole journey for me is from the Quiero tradition, which is same thing as four winds, but then they bring in some, like, Celtic shamanism and they just, you know, woven some different lineages. I would come home and my now husband, boyfriend at the time would be like, what did you do all? It was like in weekends, we would go, like four days at a time. He'd be like, what did you do?
Madi:And I'd be like, I couldn't even articulate it.
Wendy:There are no words. He's like yeah.
Madi:There are no words. I'm like, I just like Hogwarts meets, like I I but he'd say, like, you look different every time I come back. I'm like, yeah. Like, the energetics. And and I I owe I owe my whole life.
Madi:That sound dramatic. Like, my if anyone is here is interested in and they're feeling that calm, they don't know why. It just grounded me into being able to, I think, have the everything, the tools, the integrity, the capacity, the container to hold, like, myself better, but also all of this spiritual energy that I'd always been intrigued by with, but I had always just been, like, reading my own books, throwing stuff at a wall, seeing and that's beautiful to be self taught and self led. But there's something about, like, joining a lineage and sitting, you know, at the feet of a really beautiful teacher and elder and, like, in a in a community that really
Wendy:That's powerful.
Madi:Yeah. Right? Yeah. As you know. So it is that, like, anything coming up from that or anything that you want, like, in your journey?
Madi:I don't know.
Wendy:I I started having spontaneous visionary experiences about two years out of grad school, and I was studying clinical psych. And so I'm a mental health clinician who's delusional, so I didn't tell anybody about this.
Madi:My favorite part. I love that.
Wendy:It's it was true. I mean, by those standards, I was seeing things that weren't there, and I was awake. So I put it to the side, and I ended up I had I had dreams of two of the most important men in my life. I met them in my dreaming before I met them in real life. One was my favorite husband, and the other one was Hank Wesselman, who was the guy I ended up studying shamanism with.
Wendy:He had his own series of spontaneous visionary experiences, and they kind of introduced him to the Hawaiian tradition. And he didn't, and it was validated by a Hawaiian elder, Makua was his And he took him under his wing and shared the lineage, the Hawaiian Polynesian tradition to with him, and and gave all of us permission to share it because Makua wanted that he wanted this information, this old wisdom tradition to be shared with the world. And so, yeah, when I met Hank and his wife Jill later, I ended up everything made sense. Everything in my life made sense.
Madi:And it was like
Wendy:a feeling of being at home Yeah. In the dream time. And then also, as I'm sure you found is that your view of reality shifts completely. Yeah. So reality is not just this materialist cause and effect Mhmm.
Wendy:Physical existence. It's much more than that. And therefore, there's a lot more to work with. And then you get to know yourself in this way. And from this more indigenous perspective, it's a much friendlier way to work with things rather than being coming from this place of fear of your symptoms.
Wendy:For example, you make friends with your symptoms instead of trying to get rid of them Yeah. And find out what stories they have to tell you and that kind of thing. So I just think it's in our DNA. I mean, every culture pretty much comes from a shamanic tradition if you go back far enough. So Yes.
Wendy:It also resonates, I think, in this very deep way for all of us. And I think that's why there's a resurgence in in interest in shamanism. Although there's a lot of sketchy stuff. I've heard way too many bad stories.
Madi:Yeah. Right? It's like but it's also like it's that discernment thing too with people. Yeah. Like Yeah.
Madi:Like, you just feel it. Like, if you felt talking to him, it's like, we don't expect our teachers to be perfect.
Wendy:He was definitely not perfect.
Madi:No. But it's also like, feel that resonance and don't give away your power too much to them. And and also yeah. I I was going to shaman school. I like, oh my god.
Madi:So it was like a private but beautiful journey for me. And I tell people about it and they're like, okay. And then, of course, I think, like, you know, it was like January 6 and, like, the QAnon Shaman. I was like, can we
Wendy:Yeah. I
Madi:know. I'm like, yes. That are those are some people out there. And I was like, oh, yeah. Like, some people out here are really like, it's like everything in life.
Madi:Any career, there's good doctors, bad doctors, good lawyers, bad lawyers. Yeah. And it's like, I think that discernment is so important for people because like
Wendy:It's key.
Madi:You just feel it. You just know. You're like, something is off here. And and I'm so grateful you found, like, someone who was really holding this work in in a high integrity, you know, way that led you here.
Wendy:He definitely had his fault, but he also I mean, I I watched him evolve over the years that I worked with him. Really cool. He softened.
Madi:That's cool. Because yeah. Oh. Yeah. Anyway like that.
Wendy:Yeah. He was quite a character. He was a scientist, so he had that brain. He was a paleoanthropologist.
Madi:Oh, I see. I love I I I'm a sucker for the scientific brain that like gets into spirituality and just reminds us that it's all like it's all the same. There's two different sides. And I think it offers something really interesting. My astrology teacher, one of them was a theologian Baptist minister, went to school, and was writing a paper to try and disprove astrology.
Wendy:Nice. Okay.
Madi:And then he started being like, wait. There
Wendy:Oh, really?
Madi:Yeah. He's like, oh, there's something really again, pattern recognition in this.
Wendy:Open minded of because he could've really doubled down. Right?
Madi:I know. I thought that was very, very demure of him, very open minded of him, very, very life changing. And now he's like a, you know, a super prominent astrologer who does a lot of work and getting That's funny. Unlikely people, you know, into astrology. But I love when people come from that different scientific or more analytical background and can also hold space for reminding us that, like, there's so much.
Madi:There's just so many mysteries here, right, of being human and the unknown. But if we can just open our heart to them a little bit more, they have so much to hold. And I love what you said about the kinder, more gentler way of relating to ourselves or whatever we're going through. However you said that, I'm gonna go back and listen to it. I was like, that was really that was really quite beautiful.
Madi:I need to go digest that a few more times.
Wendy:Oh, that's sweet. Yeah. Well, also, I'd like to just put in a plug for even if you don't make a wise decision in who you study with or something some path you go down, that's brilliant too. Because it ends up becoming usually this huge evolutionary experience. Yes.
Wendy:Like, when you get really far away from yourself or really far away from what's important. Like, you give your like you were saying, give your power over to any kind of teacher Mhmm. No matter what tradition or whatever. Your boss. Give your power to anybody, because you think you're going to get something in return, that kind of cult mentality or whatever.
Wendy:Some kind of promise of wealth and riches or wisdom or some kind of enlightenment or some bullshit like that, then sometimes we just need to do that. That's okay. And that's alright. If you can if you can prevent that from happening, all the better.
Madi:It's like so the story of being a human. I feel like I gotta tell stories and I'm like, I really kinda fucked up there, waste some time or got rid of that path, but I'm like, but it's all part of my journey.
Wendy:I have
Madi:so But I'm like, okay. Now you as my clients or mentees or my friends or family, if you want to learn a little from my mistakes and you can find your own mistakes, but just like you could figure certain things out a little faster than I did, that would also be cool.
Wendy:But want not always not always how it works.
Madi:Exactly. Exactly. Exactly.
Wendy:I I'm especially as a parent, you're probably gonna find that you would like to prevent your child from running into a wall that's right in front of them. But they were like then all the things you say to prevent them from doing that, they're like, nope. And smack. Nope. Have to just
Madi:go down the wall. Yeah. We have to just go experience it ourselves. I feel like being a parent to a toddler is making me understand my spiritual guide so much more where they're just trying to be like, we're just trying to help you, but okay. Yeah.
Madi:You gotta just go. Okay. You gotta just go bonk your head on that. Let her bonk her head. So she realizes that's what happens when she does that or like around control.
Madi:My toddler's always trying to like get something like his hand was stuck in a jar like a, you know, Aesop fable. Like couldn't get some a pickle out of the jar. And was like, let me just let me just if you just unclench and release a little control, I could help you. And I'm like, oh, I got it. I see what you've been saying.
Madi:I got thank you for that message.
Wendy:Yep. Yep. That's it it sounds very human. But all it's we're just doing the best we can.
Madi:Jesus Christ. We really are.
Wendy:Alright, Madi. Well, I've taken up too much of your time.
Wendy:So I really enjoyed the conversation. I really appreciate you coming on. Yeah.
Madi:This was a delight. Thank you so much for having me on, Wendy.
Wendy:I'd say that was a pretty fun unfiltered conversation. Wouldn't you say? If you'd like to hang out with Madi in the cosmic zone, get a copy of her new book that goes by the same name, or just learn more about the online community she's created, please visit cosmicrx.com. Well, thank you so very much for joining me today. In our next episode, we'll be taking a compassionate look at healing our grief.
Wendy:Until next time.
